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Post by Mr. Thomas on Nov 1, 2013 7:00:50 GMT -5
"Stranger at the Gates" part 2
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Post by eddieditolla on Nov 3, 2013 11:33:01 GMT -5
Eddie DiTolla
Mr. Thomas
English 10
3 November 2013
The Odyssey Book 17 lines 317 – 676
C. I was confused in the beginning when it said “Infested with tricks, half – dead from neglect, here lay the hound, Old Argos. But the moment he sensed Odysseus standing by he thumped his tail, nuzzling low, and his ears dropped, though he had no strength to drag himself an inch toward his master. Odysseus glanced to the side and flicked away a tear, hiding it from Eumaeus.” (Book 17 lines 328 – 334) I wasn’t sure what was happening here and was confused on what was supposed to be happening during this part of the book.
D. So lines that I liked in this book was “With that he entered the well-constructed palace, strode through the halls and joined the proud suitors. But the dark shadow od death closed down on Argo’s eyes the instant he saw Odysseus, twenty years away.” (Book 17 lines 357 – 360) I liked these lines because that there will be good times soon and that there is also a symbol of an organized kingdom in the town. Another set of lines I liked was when it said “A prophet, a healer who cures disease, a worker in wood or even a god-inspired bard whose singing warms the heart – they’re the ones asked in around the world.” (Book 17 lines423 – 425) I liked these lines because it reminds me of the film movie Band of Brothers because here in these lines it talks about how they all work together like a band of brothers.
E. When it said “No quarry he chased in the deepest, darkest woods could ever slip this hound. A champion tracker too! Ah, but he’s run out of luck now poor fellow…” (Book 17 lines 347 – 350) My reactions to this set of lines were that the person is burnt out and ran out of luck. Even after that set of lines it talks about how everyone ran out of luck and is suffering I thought that this a little weird especially how Zeus robs his man of his virtues.
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Post by alfredfrederic on Nov 3, 2013 11:54:17 GMT -5
A) In today’s world, a beggar is either looked down upon or ignored and despised. People don’t really care for the beggars because most are actually lying about being poor. That is why I can understand Antinous’ reaction to Odysseus asking for food. It was cruel, but still understandable because of what happens nowadays. It is sad that now you can’t trust those asking for help because you don’t know if they’re lying or not.
C) Who says, “But there’s no way to hide the belly’s hungers- what a curse, what mischief it brews in all our lives! Just for hunger we rig and ride our long benched ships on the barren salt sea, speeding death to enemies.” (Lines 313-316) Why did Homer start talking about the dog for absolutely no reason? Does the dog have an important part in the whole plot of the book or is it narrative drift again? Why does it seem that Antinous is the most cruel out of all the suitors when he seems to be Penelope’s favorite?
E) Antinous attacked Odysseus for no reason! Who does that to a poor helpless beggar?! That shows you the kind of guy this suitor is! All of the other suitors gave bread when asked to do so by Odysseus. Antinous however, says no and then hits Odysseus with a chair because of how he looks. He seems like he would be the worst person for Penelope to marry. And this all happened right after Odysseus compliments him for being the best out of all the suitors. Funny and cruel right?
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Post by robertmaruca on Nov 3, 2013 12:23:36 GMT -5
The Odyssey Book 17 End of Book
A. The part when Antinous asks the beggar (Odysseus) what he is doing in the palace, and then Telemachus says thius is my house and if I am okay with it then he is allowed to stay reminds me of something in my life. In a real life situation if I have two friends over my house and one doesn’t like the other and one asks me why is that guy here I would say because he is my friend and as long as he is in my house then he is allowed to stay. This has happened to me before and I thought it resembles the scene in the Odyssey a lot.
E. I think that Antinous’ decision to throw something at Odysseus was very uncalled for. First of all Antinous started the insulting and like anybody else Odysseus (the beggar) gave it back. I don’t think it was right to something at him. Antinous really follows the stereotype of being a suitor because he loves to insult people and he physically hurt Odysseus like Melanthius. I believe that Antinous and Odysseus should have just talked it out. I don’t think there needed to be the throwing on anything to sort out an argument.
F. I think that the beggar (Odysseus) and Eumaeus have really developed a strong relationship. After Odysseus stayed in his shelter for three days I expected them to form a strong team. In the palace they helped each other out and now really look like good friends. I predict Eumaeus to be a crucial character in next books.
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Post by chrisnoble on Nov 3, 2013 17:51:11 GMT -5
E. I feel bad for Argos, Odysseus’ dog. Argos is: “Infested with ticks, half-dead from neglect, here lay the hound, old Argos” (page 364 lines 328-329). Argos has had nobody to love since Odysseus left for Troy. I can’t imagine my dog in this condition and if I saw my dog this way I’d be very upset.
F. The relationship between Odysseus and his dog Argos has definitely declined. “Now, as they talked on, a dog that lay there lifted up his muzzle, pricked his ears…It was Argos, long enduring Odysseus’ dog he trained as a puppy once, but little joy he got since all too soon he shipped to sacred Troy” (page 363 lines 317-321). This quote shows that Argos is no longer happy to see Odysseus since Odysseus has been away from home for so long. Argos and Odysseus had a great relationship before Odysseus left for Troy: “Odysseus glanced to the side and flicked away a tear, hiding it from Eumaeus, diverting his friend in a hasty, offhand way” (page 364 lines 333-335). Argos is now a tick-infested dog with nobody to love. Although Odysseus sheds a tear as he sees Argos, the relationship between the two is far from what it used to be.
I. I agree with Alfred’s comments about beggars these days. There is no possible way to find out how a beggar is actually poor or not and that is probably why most people that beg for don’t receive a lot of money from people on the street.
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Post by kevinmcmahon on Nov 3, 2013 19:00:20 GMT -5
D) One line that I enjoyed in “The Odyssey” book 17 lines 317 – 676 was when Odysseus meets with his beloved dog. Even though this line is quite sad I like it because it shows how a owner and a beloved pet would act when they have been away from each other for a really long time. Here it says “As they talked on, a dog that lay there lifted up his muzzle, pricked his ears… It was Argos, long enduring Odysseus’ dog he trained his puppy once, but little joy he got since all too soon he shipped to sacred Troy. In the old days young hunters loved to set him coursing after the wild goats and deer and hares. But with his master gone he lay there, castaway, on piles of dung from mules and cattle, heaps collecting out before the gates till Odysseus’ serving – men could cart it off to manure the king estates. Infested with ticks, half – dead from neglect, here lay the hound, old Argos. But the moment he sensed Odysseus standing by he thumped his tail, nuzzling low, and his ears dropped, though he had no strength to drag himself an inch toward his mater. Odysseus glanced to the side and flicked away a tear”.
E) One character that I did not like in this book was the suitor Antinous. The reason I did not like Antinous because he had shown no signs of hospitality. Here it says “Good god almighty! Antinoous cut the beggar short. What spirit brought this pest to plague our feast? Back off! Into the open, clear off my table, or you, you’ll soon be back in an Egypt, Cyprus, to break your heart! What a brazen shameless beggar! Scrounging food from each man in turn, and look at their handouts, reckless, never qualm, no holding back, not when making free with the next man’s goods – each ones got plenty here”.
?) One thing I do not understand is why Antinous was so mean. The reason I do not understand this is because it states “How kind you are to me, Antinous, kind as a father to his son”.
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Post by victorpasquin on Nov 3, 2013 19:40:11 GMT -5
C) I didn't understand when it said, “Infested with tricks, half – dead from neglect, here lay the hound, Old Argos. But the moment he sensed Odysseus standing by he thumped his tail, nuzzling low, and his ears dropped, though he had no strength to drag himself an inch toward his master. Odysseus glanced to the side and flicked away a tear, hiding it from Eumaeus.” (Book 17 lines 328–334) I was lost when I read this quote because they were talking about Argos, Odysseus' dog and Eumaeus.
E) I feel upset for Argos. Homer describes Argos and his frustrations when he says, “Infested with ticks, half-dead from neglect, here lay the hound, old Argos” (Book 17 lines 328-329). Basically, Homer says that Argos has been lonely since Odysseus has left and doesn't have anyone to play with or love.
F) Argos and Odysseus' relationship has substantially declined over the years. “Now, as they talked on, a dog that lay there lifted up his muzzle, pricked his ears…It was Argos, long enduring Odysseus’ dog he trained as a puppy once, but little joy he got since all too soon he shipped to sacred Troy” (Book 17 lines 317-321).
Argos is not excited when Odysseus returns home and no longer wants to see him. Before Odysseus had left for Troy, him and Argos had a great relationship, as would most dogs and owners.
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Post by nicholasleong on Nov 4, 2013 8:04:37 GMT -5
I. I agree with Alfred where he says “In today’s world, a beggar is either looked down upon or ignored and despised. People don’t really care for the beggars because most are actually lying about being poor. That is why I can understand Antinous’ reaction to Odysseus asking for food. It was cruel, but still understandable because of what happens nowadays. It is sad that now you can’t trust those asking for help because you don’t know if they’re lying or not.” In todays world this is so true. I see beggar’s all the time and I know they are hungry or that’s what they say they are but I still don’t give money to them.
E. One character that I don’t really care for/like is Antinous. I feel like he is very fake and doesn’t deserve anything in life. For example, when he insults Odysseus it was not called for.Odysseus did nothing to deserve the two things that he did to Odysseus
F. I feel like Odysseus and his dog used to have a relationship like any dog owner would have with their dogs. However, This relationship is barely in existent. When Odysseus’s dog see/ sniffs him he doesn’t get to excited and I understand that. Although it was not Odysseus’s fault, he was gone for 20 years.
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Post by luissantana on Nov 4, 2013 12:16:02 GMT -5
D) I enjoyed it when the suitors gave Odysseus food. I liked this because they thought this was a good thing to do because he was disguised as the beggar. I think is shows that they are somewhat nice. Even if they gave it to him and where reluctant to do so. This shows that the suitors can be nice in some occasions. But why did antinous have to be so mean and also called him a "thing" I believe.
E) I really think that antinous is now the worse character in the book. The reason is because we have saw many times that he has been doing something that is wrong. Then to insult the beggar someone who doesn't have much is a really mean thing. He called Odysseus a thing which was really mean. He went out of his way just to do so.
G)Acting as if I am Odysseus. I can't believe that antinous is doing this to me. I have saved his father from being killed and this is how he acts. Even if he doesn't know that it is really me it's still horrible the way he acts. Especially calling a beggar a thing. I can't believe he has said this, it is just horrible.
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Post by VonGarcia on Nov 4, 2013 22:54:58 GMT -5
C.) I didn’t really see the significance of putting the story of the dog, Argos, in to the mix of the story. Why would Homer put it in there for no reason. I also don’t know why he would cry since it told us that he barely had any time with the dog since we had to leave for war. I wouldn’t think that he was that attached to the dog. Also, we never heard anything about this dog before so I don’t know why he’s crying since it seemed like he never thought og this dog even once.
E.) I like the scene where Odysseus meets his dog. Even though we never heard about this particular dog before, we still get the feeling that the dog was special to Odysseus. But, I don’t know why he didn’t think of the dog even once. I think he only cried when the dog died since it reminded him of how long he has been out. Also, I think it also symbolized how much has changed since he’s been gone. One scene I don’t like is when Antinous disrespected beggar Odysseus. He acted like a complete jerk and he acted as if he owned the palace and can do whatever he wants.
I.) I also agree with Kevin. That was also my favorite scene. Even though we heard nothing of this dog before, we still get the feeling that he loved him. The dog also was waiting for him and I thought it was sweet when the dog recognizes him even in his disguise. It was unfortunate that Argos had to die.
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