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Post by Mr. Thomas on Oct 11, 2013 9:23:37 GMT -5
Post responses here.
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Post by alfredfrederic on Oct 14, 2013 0:05:56 GMT -5
B) Here, Odysseus has traveled to the house of death to talk to the seer of Thebes who tells him what will happen to him. We get an insight into what will happen in the coming chapters. It also reveals what happens to a person after they die in Greece Culture. It seems that Odysseus was surprised by what the seer of Thebes was telling him, didn’t he? Finally we get to see what happened to his family, and what is happening to them during this story. Odysseus’s mother is dead, and his father: “Keeps to his own farm-he never goes to town-with no bed for him there, no blankets, glossy throws; all winter long he sleeps in the lodge with servants.” (Lines 215-217, Book 11)
C) Why did Odysseus’ mother have to drink the blood before she remembered him? In Greek culture, did you lose your memory in death? Why was the seer of Thebes so giving of information? Did he have to tell Odysseus? What did he mean by, “Curb their wild desire and curb your own”? (Line 119, Book 11) How did he already know Odysseus? Did he see him coming?
E) I am surprised at how open Tiresias was to Odysseus. You’d expect him to be secretive and closed off because of his ability. Yet, he was willing to help Odysseus anyway. Why was that? Was it because of his status? Did he have to be willing to help others? It is surprising what he told Odysseus.
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Post by kyleconnolly on Oct 14, 2013 11:46:22 GMT -5
C) I was a bit confused as to who Elpenor is. It says he is Odysseus’ friend, but he wasn’t with the crew because Circe had turned Odysseus’ crew into pigs, and it said he had died when he fell down and snapped his neck. Also, why was he on the roof of Circe’s house and why did he refuse to climb down the ladder? “I’d bedded down on the roof of Circe’s house but I never thought to climb back down again by the long ladder-headfirst from the rood I plunged, my neck snapped from the backbone, my soul flew down to Death.” (Book 11 Lines 68-72) Did Elpenor not see the ladder or did he refuse to climb back down and face Circe? D) One part of the reading I liked was when Tiresias had drunk the blood and was talking to Odysseus about how he still has a chance at home, and what he needs to do in order to get back to his home in Ithaca. “‘A sweet smooth journey home, renowned Odysseus, that is what you seek but a God will make it hard for you-I know-you will never escape the one who shakes the earth, quaking with anger at you still, still enraged because you blinded the Cyclops, his dear son. Even so, you and your crew may still reach home, suffering all the way, if only you have the power to curb their wild desire and curb your own, what’s more from the day your good trim vessel first puts in at Thrinacia Island, flees the cruel blue sea.’” (Book 11 Lines 111-121) I) alfredfrederic Odysseus mother had to drink from the blood because Tiresias had said “‘Any one of the ghosts you let approach the blood will speak the truth to you. Anyone you refuse will turn and fade away’” (Book 11 Lines 167-169) |
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Post by robertmaruca on Oct 14, 2013 11:47:10 GMT -5
The Odyssey Chapter 11 Lines 1-267
B. This section of Chapter 11 is significant to the book because it unveiled a lot of information that has been troubling Odysseus in past chapters. Tiresias lets Odysseus know that he will reach Ithaca safely and that his son and wife have been okay in Ithaca while Odysseus has been at sea.
E. I thought it was interesting when Tiresias was telling Odysseus all his fortunes and what is going on in his home in Ithaca. I thought Tiresias was going to be a little rude or mean because he knows all the answers, but instead he was a nice character that didn’t give Odysseus any trouble. Tiresias also didn’t keep any secrets from Odysseus.
G. If I were Odysseus right now I would feel very happy and accomplished. I would also feel a little relieved because if I were going to the underworld (hell) I would be scared, but instead Odysseus was greeted by nice people and didn’t run into any problems with the people in the underworld. I would also thank Circe for not tricking me because at first I would think that this would be a way for her to kill me but instead it was a very convenient trip because I learned my fortunes that turned out to be positive. I would feel accomplished because after learning my positive fortunes it would make me feel that I am only a couple days away from reaching my home.
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Post by eddieditolla on Oct 14, 2013 16:47:05 GMT -5
Eddie DiTolla
Mr. Thomas
English 10
14 October 2013
The Odyssey Book 11 lines 1 – 267
D. “ A sweet smooth journey home, renowned Odysseus, that is what you seek but a god will make it hard for you – I know – you will never escape the one who shakes the earth, quaking with anger at you still, still enraged because you blinded the Cyclops, his son.” ( Book 11 lines 111-116) The person that says these lines is the famous Theban prophet. These lines tell Odysseus that he will suffer after what he has done to Poseidon’s son and tells him that he should be on the lookout for anything to do with the sea. My favorite part of this quote is when it says quaking with anger because it exactly like Poseidon. He is the god of earthquakes and it says quaking with anger so Homer is using what Poseidon is to use it to express his anger. Another part of Book 11 that I like is “No, it was my longing for you, my shinning Odysseus you and your quickness, you and your gentle ways that tore away my life that had been sweet.” (Book 11 lines 230 – 233) Odysseus’ mother says these lines to Odysseus and she is telling him because of his undying love made her die. It is also that his mother sees him that no one else does. It is also when in the 12 step of becoming a hero it is Odysseus descent into darkness
H. The scene in the book that I chose is when Odysseus goes down to the underworld and when he is down there. I imagine gray clouds like it is going to storm and a huge water eddy gulps in Odysseus and his ship and they enter the underworld. When his ship is in the underworld it is in an underwater cave but, dry. It is a big arching cave and it is dark red with black as the colors. The water is like the dead people’s voices and the ghosts are flying bodies so Odysseus’ ship is is anchored in the river of oceans. His mother is in her 80s with gray hair and looks pretty. Persephone the queen of the underworld is very pretty and she is wearing a very dark blue dress and all of the ghosts are white. The only way the ghosts can talk is if they drink the blood.
I. I disagree with Alfred and agree with Kyle because Odysseus mother had to drink from the blood because Tiresias had said “Any one of the ghosts you let approach the blood will speak the truth to you. Anyone you refuse will turn and fade away’” (Book 11 Lines 167-169) That why I agree and disagree with those students.
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Post by kevinmcmahon on Oct 14, 2013 17:55:31 GMT -5
D) One quote that I really enjoyed in “The Odyssey” lines 1-267 was when Odysseus was talking to Tiresias, seer of Thebes. Here “I know you will never escape the one who shakes the earth, quaking with anger at you still, still enraged because you blinded the Cyclopes, his dear son. Even so, you and your crew may still reach home, suffering all the way, if you only have the power to curb their wild desire and curb your own, what’s more, from the day your good trim vessel first puts in at Thrinacia Island, flees the cruel blue sea”. The reason I like this line in the book because It is sort of a recap of what had happened to Odysseus so far on his journey tailing to the Island of Calypso. It is also a way to foreshadow what happened after Calypsos Island and what will happen throughout the rest of the book.
E) One part of book 11 I found quite sad was when Odysseus was confronting the ghost of his dead mother. Here she says “And I with the same grief, I died and met my fate. No sharp-eyed Huntress showering arrows through the halls approached and brought me down with painless shafts, nor did some hateful illness strike me, that so often devastates the body, drains our limbs of power. No, it was my longing for you, my shining Odysseus you and your quickness, you and your gentle ways that tore away the life that had been sweet”. The reason I found this sad because the longing for one’s son drove a mother to her death.
H) If I was designing this scene for a movie I would use a lot of special effects and scary Items. The reason I would use “and up in Erebus they came, flocking towards me now, the ghosts of the dead and gone”.
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Post by chrisnoble on Oct 14, 2013 19:49:08 GMT -5
C. I don’t understand how Tiresias knows all about Odysseus’s future. “Leave the beasts unharmed, your mind set on home, and you all may still reach Ithaca-bent with hardship, true-but harm them in any way, and I can see it now: your ship destroyed, your men destroyed as well” (page 253 lines 125-128). How does Tiresias know exactly what is going to happen. He even guarantees that this will all happen when he says “All that I have told you will come true” (page 254 line 257). This scares me a little and I also think it scares Odysseus as well.
D. When Odysseus is asking his mom all about his home, Odysseus says: “But tell me about yourself and spare me nothing. What form of death overcame you, what laid you low, some long slow illness? Or did Artemis showering arrows come with her painless shafts and bring you down? Tell me of father, tell of the son I left behind: do my royal rights still lie in their safekeeping?” (page 255 lines 193-198). This quote shows that Odysseus really misses his home. He hasn’t been home in years and he knows nothing about what had happened for almost the past decade. He didn’t even know that his mom had died.
G. When Odysseus is talking to the ghost of Elpenor, he must be at least a little creeped out. He is talking to a ghost! If I was Odysseus, I would be pretty scared because I know that ghosts aren’t real.
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Post by victorpasquin on Oct 14, 2013 20:28:13 GMT -5
I. I agree with both Kyle and Eddie that Odysseus' mother had to drink the blood because Tiresias says, “‘Any one of the ghosts you let approach the blood will speak the truth to you. Anyone you refuse will turn and fade away’” (Book 11 Lines 167-169).
C. Throughout the reading, I was confused as to Elpenor was. At first it says that he wasn't apart of Odysseus' crew but he was Odysseus' friend. It gets even more strange, why in the world was Elpenor on Circe's roof and refusing to get off? “I’d bedded down on the roof of Circe’s house but I never thought to climb back down again by the long ladder-headfirst from the rood I plunged, my neck snapped from the backbone, my soul flew down to Death.” (Book 11 Lines 68-72) It could either be two things: Elpenor did not see the ladder or he was afraid to go down and face Circe.
D. When Odysseus says to his mother, “But tell me about yourself and spare me nothing. What form of death overcame you, what laid you low, some long slow illness? Or did Artemis showering arrows come with her painless shafts and bring you down? Tell me of father, tell of the son I left behind: do my royal rights still lie in their safekeeping?” (Book 11 lines 193-198). When Odysseus says this, he shows that he has not been home for a long time. Also, it shows that he is oblivious to the events that have happened in the last decade. What's pretty sad is that he didn't even know that his mother had died, that's pretty screwed up.
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Post by jcktffy on Oct 14, 2013 21:37:51 GMT -5
Book 11 Lines 1-267
If I was the Character Odysseus I would feel extremely excited and happy. I would feel this way because the prophet, Theban, has foretold Odysseus fate; he will return home, reclaim his wife and palace from the wretched suitors, and then make another trip to a distant land to appease Poseidon. All the work of him trying to return home will finally pay off and he will also try to appease Poseidon and have peace in his life.
Just to reiterate I also agree with both Kyle and Eddie that Odysseus' mother had to drink the blood because Tiresias says, “‘Any one of the ghosts you let approach the blood will speak the truth to you. Anyone you refuse will turn and fade away’” (Book 11 Lines 167-169). If she did not drink the blood her memory of him would have been lost.
Responding to Chris Noble’s question “I don’t understand how Tiresias knows all about Odysseus’s future. “Leave the beasts unharmed, your mind set on home, and you all may still reach Ithaca-bent with hardship, true-but harm them in any way, and I can see it now: your ship destroyed, your men destroyed as well” (page 253 lines 125-128). How does Tiresias know exactly what is going to happen. He even guarantees that this will all happen when he says “All that I have told you will come true” (page 254 line 257). This scares me a little and I also think it scares Odysseus as well.” I believe that this guy Tiresias knows all about the future because he has special powers that let him understand what is going on, I believe that is almost foreshadowed in the book.
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Post by peterboustani on Oct 14, 2013 22:33:15 GMT -5
C. What I didn’t quite understand completely was the part where Odysseus talks to his mother Anticleia. It confused me a little as they never explain how she died. I was just curious as they seem to just leave us as the reader hanging as they never explain her ultimate fate and how she knew everything going on to a pretty recent point at Odysseus’ home of Ithaca. Was she able to see it from the underworld or did she die very recently. Though Tiresias had said “‘any one of the ghosts you let approach the blood will speak the truth to you.” it threw me off. Maybe the blood was the key but then how come no other one of the dead people had the knowledge.
D. One thing that I do not enjoy in Greek mythology is the fact that there are prophecies and also things heroes are told not to do in prophecies. I do not like them because I feel that one, they take away a sense of free will and surprise for what is to come in an adventure and also I feel that it forces people into certain predestined fates. It makes Odysseus’ whole adventure for me feel as though the heroes are given no real choices in their lives which is why when Odysseus is given all of these prophecies I didn’t specifically like that part.
I. I really liked the way that Eddie envisioned the scene where Odysseus goes into the underworld as when reading I envisioned a similar sequence going on.
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Post by VonGarcia on Oct 14, 2013 22:35:53 GMT -5
C.) Book 11 line 38-42: “And once my vows and prayers had invoked the nations of the dead, I took the victims, over the trench I cut their throats and the dark blood flowed in.” Why did he have to cut the victims, which I’m guessing are the flock of sheep, throats open? Was this necessary? In line 36, he says “and to Tiresias, alone, apart, I would offer a sleek black ram, the pride of all my herds.” Why did he offer this special black ram to him? Did the black ram symbolize anything?
E.) I don’t really get how it is possible to not notice that one of your crewmembers is dead. Was his crew really that big that he wouldn’t notice one person is missing? Also, I found the cutting of the “victims” scene too bloody and disturbing. I like it when the Theban prophet finally tells him what going on. He even tells him how the men from his home are being pigs and are courting his wife. Also, he finally finds out that it was because of him blinding the Cyclops that leads to his crappy and miserable life.
G.) If I was playing the part of Odysseus and I hear Theban telling me about what’s going to happen and what currently happening back in Ithaca, I would be pissed. I would be extremely mad at myself, since it was because of me that Poseidon is raining all this crap into my life. Also, I would be so mad at everyone at Ithaca for trying to get my wife, Penelope
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Post by luissantana on Oct 14, 2013 23:47:56 GMT -5
D) I liked when Odysseus was talking to the ghost of his friend Elpenor, the one who died when he fell from the roof. Odysseus said “All this my unlucky friend… I will do for you. I won’t forget a thing”. I thought that’s this was a great thing if Odysseus follows through and does what Elpenor asked. What he asked was for them to burn him in full armor instead of leaving him unburied. Also to do this so that others may learn about his story.
E) I thought that Odysseus was very strong when he saw the ghost of his mother. I thought so because I know it would be hard for me to even speak to the ghost of my mother. I would probably just be shocked and crying. But he was crying but was able to speak to her. He went to hug his mother but couldn’t, “Three times I rushed towards her desperate to hold her, three times she fluttered through my fingers…” This was probably something that got to him but he was strong enough to stay and talk to the figure that was his mother. I don’t know how he was able to have the strength to do such a thing.
G) Acting as Odysseus. I can’t believe that I just saw my mother. It was just so painful to have her flutter through my fingers. It was even worse to know that I was the reason why she died; it was because she was waiting for me. Why couldn’t she wait longer? Why couldn’t I just go home and never stopped on all these islands? It’s all my fault.
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