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Post by Mr. Thomas on Sept 12, 2013 9:39:17 GMT -5
Post your responses to the handout here.
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Post by eddieditolla on Sept 12, 2013 20:10:00 GMT -5
Eddie DiTolla
Mr. Thomas
English 10
12 September 2013
Archetype Article
E. I found many of the ideas in this packet quite confusing to read. I understood several of the specific thoughts and concepts, but I am not exactly sure how to tie them together. One idea I understand “ Archetypes evoke profound emotional responses in the reader because they resonate with an image already existing within” (page 2, F), I am not certain I always agree with. Using the example he used, when someone refers to a ‘grandma’ I usually imagine in my mind an older woman with gray hair, wearing an apron and baking cookies – always available for a big hug. This however is not always the case in real life. He is saying that the image of a grandma (and everything I think) has a universal image with like characteristics. So I do not think that the ‘image’ of a person or thing always has the same characteristics.
D. “In the stories that speak to us most deeply, these elements remain remarkably constant …..the places the hero visits, from the enchanted castle to magic mountains – all these appear over and over again in myths from around the world” (p. 5, K) I like this idea because I think it is a part of human nature to want things to end happy and well and that everyone lives happily ever after. Heroes always come out on top and the good guys always win. No matter where in the world you are, this is sort of a universal belief is realized.
C. Are haunted houses always scary? Do ruby slippers ever mean anything but good? I feel that Carl Jung’s theory on these types of non-living things and objects could be accurate. I have never had an image of a happy haunted house nor have ever felt that they are warm and welcoming. Ruby slippers mean Dorothy gets home, the witch is dead and things are all good. I think that is what Jung is telling us and if so I would agree.
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Post by Mr. Thomas on Sept 12, 2013 20:11:18 GMT -5
Sample posting:
B. If it were not for archetypes good or bad, stories would have no story lines! There would be no conflicts and especially no heroes. This text explains the very importance and meaning of archetypes both good and bad. The importance of a hero archetype is for the ‘Ordinary World’ to have their sanity and safety. The reader or characters in the story depend on their hero for things.
A. One other part that I was very entertained to read was the twelve stages of how a hero is formed (Campbell Hero Model). This model plays thought one of my favorite things to read: comics. As peter parkers grandfather said to him “with great power comes great responsibility” Spiderman is a great representation to hero archetypes. Spiderman goes through all of the tests of a hero. He is called to duty by his city, New York. He is tested in many different aspects by villains and even goes through dark stages. But, that is the point of a hero archetype, to be tested and challenged and still be true to that ‘call of duty’.
E. I really enjoyed the reference to the Godfather in this writing. The comparison is a great one. The pain, loss, and all other things went through by this gang to keep their personal code. I also really enjoyed that said “viewing bad guys as the good guys”. These types of heroes I feel are always the more impacting types. They are doing something bad, but for a good reason.
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ryan
New Member
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Post by ryan on Sept 12, 2013 20:24:27 GMT -5
D. The main idea of this reading was obviously Archetypes, but the way I dumb it down is by seeing this whole reading as relating to human life. On the very first page one sentence sums everything up, whether it is life or some fantasy book or such. The sentence is “In other words, in our entire history of us as a species, things happen over and over again dating back to our greatest passable grandmother: finding/growing food, forming relationships, having children, experiencing loss, etc.”. I see so much truth in this statement when I look as far back as the Romans copying the Greeks religion or even things as major and foolish as basically starting a second world war right after finishing the first.
E. I found great humor but also felt sad and depressed when reading on the 6th page that we essentially made up the search for Eden because man yearns for a paradise and peace of mind. My sadness and depression towards these things was brought forth because this search for Eden reminds me of many times I have felt lost and had no idea why or where I should turn when in reality all I needed was a piece of mind.
C. I am still very confused towards the aspect of collective unconsciousness. I understand that it is you basically involuntarily thinking about something without realizing it, but I still feel as if I am not grasping the full concept of it.
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Post by martinsteffens on Sept 12, 2013 20:45:17 GMT -5
H) Just after reading the first page I can get an idea of what they are trying to say with the ancestors. I feel like it is a lot of people who just feel like they heard of this. “In other words, in our entire history of us as a species, things happen over and over again dating back to our greatest possible grandmother”. It is a bunch of actors who are just getting the sense of déjà vu and later it will be like the famous Yogi Bera quote “It’s like déjà vu all over again.”
G) If I was an actor trying to perform an archetype I would think it’s just one big dream that I’m living in. Most of the heroic journeys, I feel, are much more fictional than realistic. “Collective unconscious: You have an individual unconscious state, but humanity also shares an unconscious; as humanity continues to grow, the pool of experiences in the collective unconscious continues to grow as well.
C) I’m confused of how and why Mr. Karl Jung would even be thinking about collective unconscious. I believe like that is more a “little kid thing” believing in nightmares. Then again I still have my fears now so I can see Mr. Jung’s point. Lastly where does he come up with reacting to their dreams when they are awake.
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Post by chrisnoble on Sept 12, 2013 20:53:04 GMT -5
d. I liked when the reading talked about archetype and it gave examples. “You are the pond or the bell, the story is the pebble hitting the water or striking the bell.” (page 2) I liked this part because it helped me understand what archetypes are. It is knowing about the experience without it being described. When a pebble hits the water, I know what will happen; I will hear and see a splash and the water will ripple in a circle pattern. When a pebble hits a bell, I know that a “ping” sound will be produced and that the bell will vibrate. How loud it “pings” and how long it vibrates will depend on how hard the pebble hits the bell.
e. “The collective unconscious is a theory based on the individual unconscious mind but extrapolated to all human civilization.” (page 2) I feel that this theory is very interesting because it says all humans inherit the same experiences, like birth, death, and relationships. Not only do we inherit traits like hair and eye color from our parents, we all inherit traits or experiences from mankind. Like mankind evolves, the collective unconscious evolves or continues to grow with each generation.
c. Can all literature be classified as an archetype? The reading gave examples of archetypes. Is that a complete list, or are there more? Does a story have one archetype or can it have more than one?
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Post by jcktffy on Sept 12, 2013 21:10:24 GMT -5
C. The article to me was overall a confusing article to read because the ideas were all over the place such as going from parts in our history to television shows.
E. The part of the book that i liked the most was how, although confusing, really helped me understand what an archetype was and went into great detail about what an archetype is.
I. Responding to marty I believe that Mr. Karl Jung thought about those things because although they were sort of childish they were in detail and i do not believe that a child could think of all that.
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Post by jcktffy on Sept 12, 2013 21:10:55 GMT -5
C. The article to me was overall a confusing article to read because the ideas were all over the place such as going from parts in our history to television shows.
E. The part of the book that i liked the most was how, although confusing, really helped me understand what an archetype was and went into great detail about what an archetype is.
I. Responding to marty I believe that Mr. Karl Jung thought about those things because although they were sort of childish they were in detail and i do not believe that a child could think of all that.
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Post by kevinmcmahon on Sept 12, 2013 21:32:52 GMT -5
D) Some of the lines in this passage were quite enjoyable and explained a lot about what occurs in archetypes. One line that helps explain a lot about the passage was “The activities communication and advantages in which the mythic hero participates”. This helps a lot because it will explain how things in the story will play along. It will explain how the mystic adventures of the hero will help the hero complete his task. Not only has that but the adventures a hero takes will help him complete his greater good at the end. It will also help the hero somehow be able to find his or her self.
E) One idea that I had confronted in this reading was the idea of a collective unconscious. In the story it states that “it is a theory based on the individual unconscious mind (i.e. when you dream) but extrapolated to all human civilization.”. This explains that even though one person is unconscious that does not mean that their ideas and thoughts won’t stop. In fact the thoughts and everything based around it will continue to manifest to the rest of the world and other subconscious thoughts.
I) In response to Chris Noble question about whether or not all work of literature are archetypes I believe that not all literature are archetypes. As it kept explaining in the book most archetypes accrue when there is a hero in the story that goes through a great travel. While in other works of literature such as poems there really is no story or a hero going through a drastic change
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Post by VonGarcia on Sept 12, 2013 21:39:32 GMT -5
D. I enjoyed it when it talked about how generations of people experience the same thing, kind of like a cycle. “Finding/growing food, forming relationships, having children, experiencing loss, etc.” (Page 1, slide 2) I think it gave me a sense of what an archetype is and it helped wrap up the idea. I think it was also extremely interesting when it said that we inherit experiences gathered from all our ancestors on the first slide of the second page. I found it interesting how it proved that humans have a pattern of which we work. (Page 4) This kind of shows us how experiences gets passed down and inherited.
C. “These experiences gather in the “collective unconscious” of the human race and are inherited by us.” (Page 2 Slide 1) Did we really inherit those experiences? And if we did, then why do we still make the same mistakes over and over again? How did Karl Jung come up with the idea of the collective unconscious?
E. The idea of experience itself being inherited by us is already interesting. Also, I was amazed at how much of the things from the story were true. I also agree when it said, “Archetypes evoke profound emotional responses in the reader because they resonate with an image already existing within.” Sometimes, when I read I recall things from the past and common event that has already happened in my life.
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Post by nicholasleong on Sept 12, 2013 22:16:03 GMT -5
C. I thought this reading was very boring and I didn’t really like it. I didn’t like it because I felt it was boring and just a bunch of facts on a paper. However I do have a question about it. “What is an Archetype?”
I personally agree with Eddy Ditola because it took me a very long time to read it because I really had too focus more than ever to try to read and understand it. Another thing that I agree with is where he says “grandma’ I usually imagine in my mind an older woman with gray hair, wearing an apron and baking cookies – always available for a big hug. This however is not always the case in real life. He is saying that the image of a grandma” I also see me grandma as an older woman with no grey hair, baking, and always being there for their sons and grandkids.
D.one quote that I enjoyed was “we would like to believe that humans in each region are different, but actually we are more similar than different.” I enjoyed this quote because it really makes you think about people in the other side of the world and see that we are exactly the same even though we think we are totally different from them. Once I had this one friend who thought that he was totally different then this one kid. He was very mean to that kid and this just makes me think of that situation and how we are all the same.
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Post by kyleconnolly on Sept 12, 2013 22:36:20 GMT -5
C)I personally am still a little confused on the collective unconsciousness. I don't understand the whole concept of people telling stories which reveal "what's going on inside of us...not just as individuals, but together as a species." (Page 3) How can you tell a story that is inside of you as an individual, but "not just as individuals." (Page 3) I was looking at the picture comparing Personal Consciousness, and Personal Unconsciousness and I was unable to spot a difference to the point where I could separate the two of them. Overall I'm just confused about the whole idea/concept in general.
E) The part of the reading I liked especially was the Archetype examples because it interested me. It says that some things as simple as Drivers license, receiving Confirmation or a Bar Mitzvah, turning both 18 and 21 years old, or graduating. I didn't understand it, until it said "One phase of existence to another phase, challenges you to endure to make/become something more." Whenever I hear "Archetype" I don't think of drivers licences, or confirmations.
D) "Grow through conflict, suffering produces gain, no pain no gain." I love this quote because it relates to almost everybody when it comes to a conflict. It's either you take the easy way out and stay away, or you go the hard way, and push yourself through the conflict, and you will achieve your goal. A large portion of people tell themselves this to motivate them, to push them to get to their goal.
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Post by luissantana on Sept 12, 2013 22:50:17 GMT -5
E. I thought that this was a little difficult to read. I thought so because it was nothing like the others; it wasn’t a story and therefore threw me off some. Another reason that I thought it was difficult to write about this was that the explanation of what an archetype is wasn’t straight forward, but you had to read into it to find it. But toward the end when the paper told about the examples of archetypes in a character or in pictures it became a little clearer what an archetype was.
C. Some questions I have about the paper are what do our ancestors, or the things that were repeated over and over have to do with an archetype? Another question is what exactly does the collective unconscious mean? To me it was somewhat hard to understand.
D. “G. Reconciliation of Opposites.” I liked this because of the reason that I believe that opposites are always great for readings. I believe so because it gains my interest in what we are reading because it makes you see two sides of things. I always find the use of opposites great to express once side better than the other also.
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Post by alfredfrederic on Sept 12, 2013 23:09:14 GMT -5
C) Do all stories that use archetypes follow the same basic plotline? How do people know the same idea in archetypes? What is the sub-consciousness people get all the ideas from? I don’t understand how it works. Does the 12-stage hero model apply for all mythic heroes? Do all heroes act alike or are they all different? Where do archetypes come around in literature? Do archetypes add any uniqueness to stories or are they mundane and not unique?
D) I really liked the examples of Archetypes C and D. These seem like the most common of all of the archetypes. What I do not understand is how each of these always seems to be used. How do archetypes move and continuously be used? Another favorite of mine was the reconciliation of opposites (G). The best line was “No pain, no gain.” This is true because always people who work hard get the best results! Isn’t that true everywhere? The hardest worker gets everything he worked for?
I) I disagree with Kevin McMahon because all literature follows a basic plot line and have similarities with each other. Don’t most books follow a basic plotline and have shared ideas? I say that all or at least most literature is an archetype. It makes sense in a way. The idea to write stories was moved and shared. Archetypes appear all over the place. Isn’t that true? Like in TV shows and the web. There are so many archetypes; it’s nearly impossible to list
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Post by victorpasquin on Sept 13, 2013 2:25:16 GMT -5
C) I thought that this was pretty difficult to read and I didn't really understand it. Overall, I donot understand when people tell stories that somehow reveal what is going on inside of us. (page 3)
E) Throughout this reading, the part that I liked the most was the examples of Archetypes, mostly
because I was actually interested in it. I was pretty confused in the beginning until it started to talk about phase of existences. It says, One phase of existence to another phase, challenges you to endure to make/become something more. (Page 6)
D) A quote that I loved the most was, Grow through conflict, suffering produces gain, no pain no gain. I enjoyed this quote because I feel that it applies to everyone’s life when they experience a conflict. You can either take the road that everyone has taken, which is the easy road, or take the one that no one has taken, the challenging road. If you have a goal or milestone that you want to reach, you are better off taking the more challenging road. People use this to motivate themselves to succeed.
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